I would like to hear arguments for and against waterboarding in counter-terrorism. I think the problem with waterboarding and any other such form of torture is precisely that it is so terrible that the temptation is that you will not gain accurate information from people who are waterboarded.

President Obama banned waterboarding in January 2009. In fact, the Field Army Manual states “The use of force, mental torture, threats, insults, or exposure to unpleasant and inhumane treatment of any kind is prohibited by law and is neither authorized nor condoned by the US government.”

This would appear to suggest that no torture, including waterboarding, is effective.

In practice the ethics of torture can be very complex and this article illustrates some of the issues from deontological and teleological ethical perspectives.

http://lancecrowe.hubpages.com/hub/Ethi ... errogation

As a commentator on a 2009 ethical dilemma regarding terrorism and torture said on this site in regards to torture, on utilitarian grounds - a teleological perspective - it could be (albeit reluctantly) regarded as necessary.

http://www.ethics.org.au/ethical-dilemm ... kidnapping

Perhaps the question should be is any form of torture effective?

No, it suggests that torture is illegal, not ineffective.

Torture is the last refuge of desperate homeland security organisations trying to save innocent lives from the lunacy of fanatics.

It's nasty and uncivilised - like abattoirs, batchhouse chicken farms, halal ritual slaughter, circumcision, and tongue-studs ~ but somebody has to do it as a procedure for eliciting vital information from stubborn personalities who'd otherwise remain 'mum'.

Vital information aye? What if the stubborn personality remaining "mum" was your son or daughter Herbert, would you still condone torture? And frequently the tortured 'stubborn" person holds no "vital" information anyway, what's the poor sod supposed to do then?
Does the confinement of a chicken really trouble you as much as human beings inflicting torture on their fellow man? Really? Surely that's not possible.
I count some torture victims among my friends, and believe torture's an inexcusable cruelty and a total obscenity.

Vital information aye? What if the stubborn personality remaining "mum" was your son or daughter Herbert, would you still condone torture? And frequently the tortured 'stubborn" person holds no "vital" information anyway, what's the poor sod supposed to do then?
Does the confinement of a chicken really trouble you as much as human beings inflicting torture on their fellow man? Really? Surely that's not possible.
I count some torture victims among my friends, and believe torture's an inexcusable cruelty and a total obscenity.

Okay! Okay! I heard you the first time!

The use of torture is a value-judgment. I used to give the fat boy at school Chinese burns until he revealed to me where he hid his chocolate bars and sugared donuts.

It never failed.

If I'd simply said to him ! "Okay Fat Boy! ~ spread 'em!" (his store of goodies onto the playground) - I would have come up empty handed every recess.

If my son or daughter belonged to a radical lunatic fringe and was withholding vital information as to the whereabouts of a ticking time-bomb planted somewhere in the city where it would do the most damage to innocent persons and property ~ I would fully understand why the authorities would deem it to be a no-brainer that a little physical persuasion just might coax a helpful answer out of them.

No you didn't hear me the first time Herbert, but I hear you.
Your story about the Chinese boy says it all.
Why am I reminded of Abu Ghraib right now?

I was just joking about the Chinese Burns!

Abu Ghraib was an utter disgrace, and shocked me all the more because it proved that the US army was populated by certifiable retards dressed in uniform, and who were being deployed to highly sensitive situations where there was little if no supervision of their activities.

You may have been joking about the Chinese burns Herbert, but new arrivals were "tortured" by older pupils at my English boarding school, a type of initiation common in many institutions including the army. Although not usually resulting in serious injury these episodes show just what animalistic behaviour can eventuate when a group mentality dominates individual conscience.
I believe torture is used by many armies, and it's used more to punish people for being who they are, than to elicit any supposed vital information.

I spent 7 years in a private English boarding school - three as a Day Boy and four as a boarder.

There was almost no bullying, and this was because of the cane being liberally used for any infractions of the rules.